“I own a piece of Grace Metalious's wallpaper that was across from her desk when she wrote Peyton Place. I'm looking at it right now.” John Waters hosts his new here!TV series “Movies That Will Corrupt You” from his Baltimore home. John Waters is “arrested” in possession of one of this “corrupting” films in this staged promotional shot. John Waters being interviewed in the offices of Houston's now-defunct This Week in Texas (TWT) in 1985. The title says it all: Beefcake. One of Water's corrupting picks. Hairspray on the Sundance Channel Feb. 17, 11 p.m. Tracy Turnblad (Ricki Lake), Tracy's mom (Divine), against Amber Von Tussle (Colleen Fitzpatrick) and Amber's mom (Debbie Harry) in John Waters's 1988 film about the '60s, integration, and hair…

THIS ISSUE > COVER STORY

John Waters has probably already corrupted you with several of his films: Pink Flamingos, Polyester, Hairspray, Cry-Baby, Serial Mom, to name a few. Now the 59-year-old hosts John Waters Presents Movies That Will Corrupt You, an original program for which Waters has chosen films that are, as he so eloquently puts it, “gaily incorrect,” movies that will “push the boundaries of gay acceptable behavior.” (Click here for list of films.) Waters will host each film from his home in Baltimore. He will begin by introducing the feature in his signature witty style and then return at the end of the film for the final wrap-up. The show debuts in February on here! TV, which is now available for subscription in Houston from TimeWarner Cable.

Blase DiStefano: Hi, John.
John Waters: Hi, Blase.

Happy New Year.
Same to you.

Are you in Baltimore?
I am. Right at my desk.

With all the books.
There's books in every room, I'm afraid. You'll get to see that on the TV show. I think there's books in every room in the house. Maybe not the bathroom, since I think it's bad for your colon to read—you should shit and get off the pot. I go to people's houses and see big baskets of reading material, and that means a colostomy bag is in reach.  

[Laughs]
I didn't mean to start the interview with such low...

Low is great. Not so low is that we're putting you on the cover of our February issue, which is also the month with Valentine's Day.
Well, I think that the month with Valentine's Day would be a good month to watch my show.

How many of the “Movies that Will Corrupt You” would you consider to be love stories?
Let me think. Well, in my world, “love story” is a loose term. The first one, Freeway, is not really. The second one, L.I.E., a movie about a very kind child molester, is certainly a love story. Fuego is about sexual passion in a marriage. Baxter is about a dog that wants to be dominated—that could be love to some people. Fluffer is about a gay guy that falls in love with a straight porn star. Clean Shaven is about schizophrenia, and it's hard to have an affair when you're schizophrenic.

[Laughs] So love story or not?
It's hard to be in love when you're schizophrenic, because you don't know who you are. When you say, “I love you,” which one? Pink Narcissus was a great love story between the director and his subject—it was almost like worship of the star.

That one I've seen. I've actually only seen half of them.
Well, you've seen a lot then, because many people have seen none. I've tried to find movies that I thought people would really like and that would be certainly not seen by most people.

I'm looking forward to seeing the others.   Do you think I'm going to be like totally corrupted after I've seen them all?
I hope so.

[Laughs]
My final thing I say at the end is that you are totally corrupted and will never be able to watch normal Hollywood movies again without yearning for more cutting-edge material, because if you watch the whole series, by then I will have had my cinematic bad influence on you.

I can't wait. Does one of the films stand out as being especially unscrupulous?
I think the closing one, Irreversible, is the most shocking. I think it's a brilliantly made movie.

That I've not seen.
The subject matter is rape, and it is quite graphic and shot in an amazingly brutally beautiful way, but Gaspar Noe is a brilliant director. It's a very important movie to see, and it certainly is an unnerving movie.

We have light ones, sort of: Fuego is a sexploitation movie and it's kind of funny. Baxter is about a dog that wants to be a French dog.

What about Beefcake?
Beefcake is a documentary about Bob Mizer. It's tragic, but it has its moments. Sissy Boy Slap Party is really funny. That's one of the shorts shown with The Hours and Times. The other short is Dottie Gets Spanked, Todd Haynes's first movie, and that certainly has some humor in it.

I was very disappointed that Peyton Place wasn't on the list.
Peyton Place to me is a very, very important book, even more than the movie, which I think is boring if you watch it today. And, basically, I don't think that would corrupt anybody.

I was definitely joking, but...
Yeah. I'm trying to pick movies... First of all, it's a gay channel, and I'm trying to pick movies that sometimes are even gaily incorrect. I'm trying to push the boundaries of what gay acceptable behavior is, too.

I don't know if you know this, but I think in 2007 that's the 50th anniversary of Peyton Place, the film.
I know that, because Vanity Fair is doing a big article about it.

And I think in 2006 is the 50th anniversary of the book.
Well, I think they're doing the book. I don't know what it is, but I've already done the interview.

Oh, you have? That's neat.
The New York Times ran a piece about [the fact that] I own a piece of Grace Metalious's wallpaper that was across from her desk when she wrote Peyton Place. So I'm looking at it right now.

Speaking of gifts, what is your most cherished gift?
I think that would be this   [the Grace Metalious wallpaper]. I have a stuffed rat that's on my desk in New York. I have a shocking present someone gave me that I keep hidden, because it's so alarming, I'm afraid the cleaning people will call the police. What are those things called where one doll fits inside another doll and they get littler and littler and...

Oh, yeah.
It's bin Laden. [Both laugh] It's really horrifying, but it was a really good gift. When it was brought to me, I thought, “I'm glad I didn't go through customs with that.” Can you imagine being in customs: “What do we have here?” “Nothing.”

[Laughs] That is so wonderfully sick. Not that that reminds me of Lana Turner, but did you ever meet her?
I did. I had Thanksgiving dinner with Lana Turner, Cheryl [Crane, Turner's daughter], and Josh [Crane's girlfriend]. It was lovely. It was the only time I could ever call my mother and say, “I'm not coming home for Thanksgiving,” and she said, “Why?” and I said, “Because I'm having it with Lana Turner.” What could she say?

[Laughs] How was it?
Lovely. She was great. We talked about Fassbinder, Sirk, everybody. It was a day I'll always remember. And certainly I'm still friends with Cheryl and Josh. I see them all the time, basically. They just came to my opening. They're coming to an event we're having in Palm Springs.

That is so neat. I want to go on to Catholicism. When I interviewed Mink Stole, we talked about our mutual Catholic upbringing. And she said she basically left the church at 16. I wondered if you...
I think about six.

[Laughs]
I remember my mother saying the first thing she remembers me rebelling about was when everybody took the Legion of Decency pledge. But certainly you can see in some of these movies where Catholicism runs its evil hand through it, believe me. Who Killed Pasolini, a perfect example. I'm not so sure that Porn Theater doesn't have something to do with it.

Porn Theater was good.
It was. A beautiful French art movie, I think. It's a very good movie, and I actually got the film distributed in America, because I saw it in Europe and kept raving about it. It flopped, and I felt guilty, but I think certainly being on here! network will give it the largest audience it's ever had. The real title in France was The Pussy with Two Heads.

[Laughs]
That's the name of the porn theater where the porn movie was playing. Porn Theater was the American title, and I think The Pussy with Two Heads was better.

Obviously. Do you remember the first condemned film you ever saw?
Yes. Baby Doll and then Never on Sunday. Those were the two I remember.

Mine was Kiss Me Stupid.
That was a good one, too. I remember that black raincoat Kim Novak wore. Good title, too.

What do you think of gay marriage?
A lot of people ask me that. I actually have no urge to walk down the aisle in an imitation of a corny heterosexual tradition. I actually hate going to weddings. However, I know that we have to fight for it, and I will fight for the straightest gay person's desire to want to do that. They should be allowed to for legal reasons, and taxes, and everything. Basically, I don't want to, but I'm certainly for it. I think a great mistake was made in the last election—we should have fought for that after the election. Bush loved it 'cause he could use those pictures of the lesbians making out in front of town hall in Provincetown... scare them in America.

It's gonna happen eventually.
Hell, yeah. Gay divorce is going to happen soon. I saw on Court TV a TV show about marriages when people kill each other. I'm waiting for the first gay one, so we can do that one. It has to be in Massachusetts.

[Laughs] How did you get Troy Donahue to be in Cry-Baby?
I just asked him. In that movie, we had Polly Bergen, Joey Heatherton, Joe Dallesandro. Troy loved it because we made him look bad. And he was so sick of having to look handsome in every movie that he was thrilled to be able to look kinda crummy.

I had a major crush on him when I was growing up.
He was very nice. I was more into Tab Hunter, who I had already used [in Polyester] too, but I liked them both very much. Troy Donahue was in one of my all-time favorite movies, Susan Slade, where the baby catches fire.  

Wasn't that the best scene in the entire world?!
That has inspired me to this day.

[Laughs] It is too unbelievable. I remember seeing that and almost laughing out loud. It was the fakest thing I've ever seen. I absolutely loved that scene. So obviously, like me, you did not confuse Troy Donahue with Tab Hunter at all.
Of course, Troy always said, “I'm the straight one.” But Tab talks about that in his book. I like them both for very different reasons. I've never confused them.

I interviewed Tab Hunter fairly recently and he was super nice.  [Editor's note: See "Fab Tab," December OutSmart.]
He's very nice and the book's good, too [Tab Hunter Confidential: The Making of a Movie Star].  

And he liked you a lot.
He was very kind to us. And he was very sweet to Divine, and Divine liked him very much, too.  

They made a great couple.   I'm curious about how you got the drag king Mo B. Dick to play a lesbian stripper in Pecker?
It wasn't hard. I think I met her by casting for the movie. I was looking in the drag king community certainly. She was straight for a while, too—I loved that—she went from drag king to f--king guys to God knows what, but I like her. I like drag kings. They look like cute boys.  

Yes, definitely. And she does look good as a guy.
She's really funny, she's a great lady, and she's gorgeous as a woman. She doesn't look that butch in real life. You can't look butch and gorgeous. In real life, she kinda was femme in a way.  

How's the new Hairspray movie coming? [Editor's note: The original Hairspray movie will air Feb. 17, 11 p.m. on the Sundance Channel.]
I don't know. I know I met the director, and I hear casting rumors. Certainly I have a financial stake in it, and I wish it well. I think very much they're reinventing the Broadway musical, and we'll see. They're supposed to shoot it this coming summer.

Is Harvey Feinstein going to be the lead?
Not that I know of. I have nothing to do with casting, I promise you. It's a $60 million Hollywood movie, so it'll probably have Hollywood stars in it. Who knows? They didn't ask me what I thought of this one. Basically, it happens a lot. Look at Barbra Streisand in Hello Dolly —Carol Channing did the play.  

Are you involved in the stage version of Cry-Baby?
Yes, I very much am. I've heard a table reading of it, I've heard the music, and I think it's going to be great.

I don't suppose Johnny Depp is going to be involved.
As much as I love him, I think Johnny is in his 30s now. It would be a little hard to play a 17-year-old. Johnny can sing though. He was in a rock-and-roll band when I met him. But I think Johnny's too busy being one of the most successful male actors in the world right now. He's got a great career. He's picked wisely. He's picked movies not to be a movie star but to show much range. He's a good friend and I still talk to him, and I'm happy that everything is going so well for him.

I'm sure you get this get this question all the time, but who were you influenced by regarding your filmmaking?
When I was   young, certainly all the ones I've written about: Russ Meyer, Warhol, Walt Disney, William Castle, Ingmar Bergman. Those are the ones off the top of my head.

That's such a great group of people. Onward to another director: Ang Lee. Have you seen Brokeback Mountain?
I have, and I liked it very much, and I think it could probably win the Oscar. And I've said it before that everything the right wing says about it is true—that it's a great recruitment film. Take a straight boy, he'll get laid.

[Laughs] What was the last movie you saw, or was that it?
The last movie I saw... Well, you know, I get all these Academy tapes, so I just mailed in all my Oscar nominations, so I watched a few that I haven't seen at the movies. So I think the last thing tape I saw, which is what counts... I'm looking in my movie diary.   I write down every movie I see.

Do you?!
Yeah. Hold on, that's last year's...

My God, you must have billions then, because if you write down everything you see...
I don't see everything these days, my God.  

You just see less...
Well, no, I'm not a masochist. I don't see a film I know I'm going to hate. They are fairly predictable on some things. The last movie I saw was Match Point, the Woody Allen movie.

How did you...
I liked it very much. It's Hitchcockian. I like every Woody Allen movie. I like the ones everybody hates. I think he has a great, great career, and I'm a big fan. And he put me in one of his movies [Sweet and Lowdown], which always helps—makes you like him. I think he's a great American director.

Speaking of great directors: I've read different dates of your birth.
April 22, 1946. I'll be 60 this year. [Under his breath] Jesus Christ. 

I was born in '47.
You're a chicken.

[Laughs] About 20 years ago, you came to Houston.
I've come since then.

But this was when I was working for a magazine called This Week in Texas [TWT], and you actually came to our offices and did an interview, and you were so sweet.
I like Houston. It's always been a good town for me with movies, and I've had fun there.  

Also, about 10 years ago, I wrote an article for OutSmart, and I sent a questionnaire to probably 50 or so national celebrities, and you were one of the few to reply.
You make me sound like a press whore.

[Laughs] I just wanted to thank you for that. Anyway, I know you live in Baltimore, but do you get to L.A. much?
I go for work. I go everywhere for work. If I'm off, I stay home. I go to Provincetown in the summer, so I'm there all summer. So, yeah, I go to L.A. all the time.

Are you going to the Oscars?
I'm not going to the Oscars. I'm going to Elton John's dinner and the big Vanity Fair party.

Last question: Do you have any regrets about anything?
I don't have any regrets really.

You don't think back...
No. I think the future is better than the past. I don't understand why anyone would want to know the future. That's so astounding to me that anyone would want to know the future. It would be so boring if we knew the future.

But, no, I don't have any regrets. I think I've had a very fortunate life. I've been able to make a living doing what I like. I certainly have sadness in my life—so many friends that have died from all sorts of things, inflicted or created. But I don't have any regrets.

Blase DiStefano interviewed Tommy Tune for OutSmart's January 2006 issue.

(Return to top.)
John Waters Presents "Movies That Will Corrupt You" (to debut February on here! TV)

1) Freeway (directed by Matthew Bright, 1996)
2) L.I.E. (directed by Michael Cuesta, 2001)
3) Fuego (directed by Armando Bo, 1969)
4) Baxter (directed by Jerome Boivin, 1989)
5) The Fluffer (directed by Richard Glatzer and Wash Westmoreland, 2001)
6) Boom (directed by Joseph Losey, 1968)
7) Beefcake (directed by Thom Fitzgerald, 1998)
8) Criminal Lovers (aka Les Amants Criminels) (directed by Francois Ozon, 1999)
9) The Hours and Times (directed byChristopher Munch, 1991, 60 mins)
+ Sissy Boy Slap Party (directed by Guy Maddin, 2004, 6 mins)
+ Dottie Gets Spanked (directed by Todd Haynes, 1993, 27 mins)
10) Pink Narcissus (directed by James Bidgood, 1971)
11) Who Killed Pasolini (aka Pasolini, un delitto italiano) (directed by Marco TullioGiordana, 1995)
12) Porn Theater (aka La Chatte a Deux Tetes) (directed by Jacques Nolot, 2002)
13) Irreversible (directed by Gaspar Noe, 2002)
At press time, there was a possibility of changes. To confirm schedule/more info: www.heretv.com.

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